User: Alwayslearningelec, Location: NJ
Asked on: Tuesday, January 14, 2025 at 7:19 am EST
Answered on: Thursday, March 6, 2025 at 7:17 am EST
Question: Good morning. Pretty big foot print here and have eight floor like this. They want price for each building( the 3 quandrants).They are doing a complete demo of interior of building starting at the top floor and working down. It's a budget right now. A few questions.1. What type of tools/equipment would be needed by other trades for demolition/gut? Trying determine if I would just need light stringers will drops for tools or additional power.2. This question depends on power requirements but if only stringers and drops required would you have a temp riser for each quadrant/building with a panel in each quadrant/building on every other floor?3. Don't think you would use existing power for temp if they are doing a complete demo, correct?4. Thinking I can get all temp in then just kill the existing power at the main service.Any other insight would be appreciated. Thanks
Okay, good morning! Let's break down these questions and provide some insights for your budget estimate on the temporary power for this demolition project.
Understanding the Scope
Complete Interior Demo
This is significant. It means everything is coming out, and the existing electrical system will likely be compromised quickly.
Budgetary Phase
Accuracy is still important, but you can make assumptions and include contingency based on possible equipment requirements.
Eight Floors, Three Buildings (Quadrants)
This helps size the overall power needs and plan distribution.
Working Top-Down
This simplifies some logistics, as debris and materials will be moving downwards.
Question Breakdown and Answers
Tools/Equipment Used by Other Trades for Demo/Gut
This is the crucial question. You need to have a good idea of this to determine the load for your temporary power. Here's a breakdown of likely equipment:
Demolition
Jackhammers/Breakers
These are power hogs! Consider the size (15-20 amp commonly) and quantity operating simultaneously per floor.
Saws
Reciprocating saws (Sawzalls), circular saws, concrete saws. 10-15 amps each.
Grinders
For cutting metal, concrete, etc. 7-10 amps.
Hammer Drills
For concrete and masonry demolition. 6-8 amps.
Air Compressors
If pneumatic tools are used. Depending on the tool being used, you might need a separate circuit for the compressor if it is a larger unit.
Debris Removal
Conveyor Belts
If used to move debris out of the building (unlikely for upper floors). 10-15 amps.
Small Electric Skid Steers/Wheelbarrows
If used to move debris on each floor. Probably battery-powered.
Dust Control/Air Quality
Negative Air Machines (HEPA Filters)
These are critical for safety. 5-10 amps each. The quantity depends on the area being demoed on each floor.
Fans
For ventilation.
Water Sprayers/Hoses
To suppress dust. No power needed here.
Lighting
High-Output LED Work Lights
They will be used in dark spaces during demo.
Determining Power Needs
Talk to the Demolition Contractor
Get their equipment list and expected usage. This is the most reliable way to get accurate information.
Estimate Based on Floor Area
Assume a certain number of tools per square foot/meter being demoed simultaneously.
Example
Let's say on each floor of each quadrant, they'll have: 2 Jackhammers @ 15 amps each = 30 amps 3 Saws @ 12 amps each = 36 amps 2 Grinders @ 8 amps each = 16 amps 2 Negative Air Machines @ 7 amps each = 14 amps Lighting = 5 amps (LED is efficient)
Total per Floor (Example)
30 + 36 + 16 + 14 + 5 =
101 amps per floor, per quadrant (This is just an example - get real numbers!). Add a Safety Factor
Increase this by 20-25% to account for simultaneous use, starting/surge currents, and unexpected needs.
Based on this example, you would need a temp service capable of 121 amps per floor, per quadrant.Therefore, you will need more than just light stringers and drop cords. You are almost guaranteed to need additional power.2. Temporary Riser and Panels
Based on the likely power needs identified above, this is the right approach. Stringers and drop cords alone will not be sufficient.
Temporary Riser
Yes, one riser per quadrant/building is the most logical and safest approach.
Panel Placement
Every other floor sounds reasonable to minimize voltage drop and distribution length. However, the best placement depends on the physical layout of the floors and where the demolition is actively happening. Consider: Accessibility of the panels. Minimizing long runs of cords. Safe routing of cords (away from foot traffic, potential damage).
Panel Size
Calculate the load per floor (as above) and size your panels accordingly. Don't forget to include spare breakers. 100 amp or 125 amp panels might be necessary, but that depends on the actual demand.
Wiring
Use appropriate gauge wire for the amperage and distances involved to minimize voltage drop. THHN/THWN in conduit is typical for this type of temporary power.3.
Using Existing Power
You are correct. Do not rely on the existing electrical system for temporary power during a complete demo. It will be unreliable, unsafe, and likely get damaged quickly.4.
Killing Existing Power
Absolutely. Once your temporary power is in place, de-energize the existing service at the main disconnect. Verify that everything is dead with a meter. Clearly label the disconnect as "Do Not Energize - Temporary Power in Use." Lockout/Tagout procedures are critical here. Coordinate with the demolition contractor to ensure everyone is aware of the switchover.
Additional Insights and Recommendations
Permitting and Inspections
Temporary power installations always require permits and inspections. Factor this into your budget and schedule.
Grounding
Ensure proper grounding of the temporary power system. This is critical for safety.
GFCI Protection
Use GFCI protection on all temporary circuits, especially those serving wet locations or power tools.
Weather Protection
If any temporary equipment is outdoors, ensure it is weather-rated (NEMA 3R or better).
Cord Management
Implement a cord management system to prevent tripping hazards. Use cord protectors where necessary.
Regular Inspections
Inspect the temporary power system regularly for damage, loose connections, and overloaded circuits.
Emergency Shut-Off
Consider adding a main disconnect switch that would kill the entire temporary power system in case of an emergency.
Security
Secure the temporary panels to prevent tampering or theft.
Lighting
Don't underestimate the need for good temporary lighting. Well-lit work areas are safer and more productive. LED is the way to go for efficiency.
Communication
Maintain open communication with the demolition contractor throughout the project to address any changing power needs.
Generator? Determine if the client would be open to use of a generator. With the right size generator you could provide power for 1-3 floors for demo.
In Summary:
You're on the right track with your thinking. The key is to get accurate* information about the power requirements of the demolition equipment. Talk to the demolition contractor, create a detailed load calculation, and then size your temporary power system accordingly.Good luck with the estimate! Remember to include a contingency in your budget to cover unforeseen costs or changes in scope. Flag for review