User: ThreeTenFifteen, Location: Portland OR
Asked on: Saturday, May 3, 2025 at 1:23 pm EDT
Answered on: Saturday, May 3, 2025 at 1:26 pm EDT
Question: Hello forum friends!I'm looking at a mass timber project that consists of cross laminated timber with a 5" topping slab on each floor. I got into a discussion with a few co-workers about pulling wire in the ENT after rebar is dropped but before the concrete is poured. The reason for doing this would be to prevent having to coordinate wire pulling to light fixture outlets on the floor below, and also to ensure that there isn't any challenges with wire pulling after concrete is poured. Article 300.18(A) talks about runs needing to be complete before the installation of conductors. My thoughts are doing this is code compliant so long as the ENT is supported as required in 362.30 and terminated at both ends. I am curious if anyone has a different understanding on this? Or if there's anything to be mindful of if we decide to go this direction?Thanks!
This is a very interesting and pertinent question, especially with the rise of mass timber construction. Your understanding is largely correct, and this is a viable method, but there are a few crucial points and considerations to keep in mind. Let's break it down
Your Understanding and Code Compliance:
Article 300.18(A) - Raceway Installation Complete
Yes, you're spot on. The general intent of this section is that raceways should be fully installed before pulling conductors. This eliminates the potential for damage to conductors during installation of the raceway itself.
Article 362.30 - Securing and Supporting ENT
Absolutely. Proper support of the ENT is essential to prevent it from being displaced during the concrete pour and vibration.
Terminating at Both Ends
This is key. The ENT must be terminated at both ends with appropriate fittings (connectors) to junction boxes or other approved terminations. This protects the conductors from moisture and debris entering the system during the concrete pour.
Key Considerations and Potential Challenges
Concrete Vibration
This is the biggest risk. Concrete vibrates aggressively during the pour to consolidate the mix and remove air pockets. This vibration can shift the ENT, especially if it isn't securely fastened.
Solution
Over-engineer your supports. Use more supports than the minimum required by 362.30. Consider using metal straps/ties in addition to the listed ENT supports to provide extra resistance to movement. Coordinate with the structural engineer or concrete contractor regarding the vibration plan and consider isolation techniques.
2.
Concrete Pressure
The weight of the wet concrete can crush or deform the ENT, especially if the concrete mix is particularly dense or the pour is deep.
Solution
Use appropriately sized ENT (consider heavier wall ENT) and ensure proper support spacing. Also, consider the depth of the concrete pour and whether additional reinforcement is needed for the ENT itself.3.
Water/Moisture Intrusion
Concrete is very alkaline and can damage some types of wire if it comes into direct contact.
Solution
Make sure your terminations are completely sealed. Consider using liquid-tight connectors or wrapping the connectors with electrical tape. The conductors chosen need to be rated for a wet environment.4.
Coordination with Other Trades
Your electrical runs need to be meticulously coordinated with other trades (plumbing, HVAC, structural). You don't want your ENT runs to conflict with reinforcement or other embedded items.
Solution
Early and frequent communication with all involved parties is crucial. Use BIM (Building Information Modeling) if available to identify potential conflicts.5.
Box Placement/Access
Ensure that the location of the boxes at each end of the ENT run is accurate and accessible after the concrete pour. The top surface of the box should be flush with the finished floor.6.
Rodent Protection
Since ENT is a non-metallic product, it is easier for rodents to chew through. Consider how you will maintain the integrity of the system and protect it from rodents chewing.7.
Inspection
Inform the local electrical inspector of your intent. They may have specific requirements or concerns based on local conditions and practices. Documentation is crucial.8.
Termination Access
Make sure your terminations (boxes) are sized appropriately for the number of conductors and devices. This will need to be calculated before the concrete pour and cannot be changed afterward.
Recommendations
Detailed Drawings
Prepare detailed drawings showing the location and routing of all ENT runs, support locations, and box placements.
Mock-up
Consider building a small mock-up section to test your installation techniques and ensure the ENT can withstand the concrete pour.
Inspection Before Pour
Have the electrical inspector and the general contractor inspect the ENT installation before the concrete pour.
Photo Documentation
Take extensive photos of the ENT installation before the concrete pour. This provides a record of the routing and support locations, which can be helpful if any issues arise later.
Consider Flexible Metal Conduit (FMC)
If you have concerns about the ENT being crushed during the concrete pour, consider using FMC instead. While it's more expensive, it's much more robust. You would need to follow the same securement and termination guidelines.
In Conclusion:
Installing ENT before the concrete pour is a viable option for this project, provided you pay very close attention to the details outlined above. Over-engineering the supports, ensuring proper termination, and meticulous coordination are key to success. Don't hesitate to consult with a structural engineer or concrete specialist for advice on how to mitigate the risks associated with concrete vibration and pressure. Good luck! Flag for review